Author Topic: Digital Only...  (Read 333 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Digital Only...
« on: May 04, 2017, 03:44:45 PM »
The digital only question persists.

I include 4x6" digital files with a book or album package, but I don't do digital only. However, I continually get people asking about it.

I'm torn between just telling them no and coming up with an answer like "$200 for the first one, $500 for five, $1000 for 20." I actually think that might be too cheap.

 I really don't think there's any point to this, because I'm guessing that when they ask for digital only, they think it's going to be cheaper, when in my mind, it should be more valuable. What are your thoughts?

Offline Darren Cassese

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7081
    • View Profile
    • http://www.fotoglyphics.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2017, 07:19:31 PM »
I believe in providing what people want and people want digital files.

I personally wouldn't hire anyone who wouldn't sell me digital only.

Perhaps you could simply price it somewhere in the mid-range of your average sales? Win-win for both you and consumer.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Think happy thoughts.  Think happy thoughts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Baltimore, Maryland Wedding and Portrait Photographer

Offline Jeff Behm

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12093
    • View Profile
    • http://www.behmphoto.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2017, 08:25:47 PM »
I agree, Todd, that they think they're going to be cheaper.  What if you had two options?  I find prints at my normal price with that image's digital file included works. But if they want digital only, I think you're right in line with what I hear is normal here. 

Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2017, 09:28:33 PM »
I believe in providing what people want and people want digital files.

I personally wouldn't hire anyone who wouldn't sell me digital only.

Perhaps you could simply price it somewhere in the mid-range of your average sales? Win-win for both you and consumer.

I actually think "selling the negatives" is worth more than "selling 8x10 prints".  Can you argue with that?

What I'm really concerned with is losing control of my images, because at the end of the day, that's all we have.  If we give away "the negatives" then if we ever do become well known and famous, then those people will be printing our work as well.

Remember, I come from a fine art background.  If Picasso sold the lithograph PLATE instead of the paper print of the lithograph, the person buying the plate would have the money.

Offline Nanette Reid

  • Authenticated Members
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 647
    • View Profile
    • nanette reid | architectural & interior photographer
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2017, 12:01:37 AM »
I don't shoot retail so not sure how this is handled by others - I *never* give up the RAWs to my clients, they get TIFs (Hi-Res) and JPGs (Low-Res).

Perhaps you could do similar?
  • Digital for prints up to 6x4"?
  • Digital for prints up to 8x10"?
  • Digital for prints 11x14" upwards?
Tier pricing that works for you - slightly less than your print packages but not so hi/low that it hurts you?

I might be waaaay off base with this, as I said not an area I work in, just my 2c worth. :)

Offline Darren Cassese

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7081
    • View Profile
    • http://www.fotoglyphics.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2017, 05:50:47 AM »
Perhaps I misunderstood. I don't ever sell the digital "negative".

Just an edited "copy".

That comes with many options you can price.

You can do FB/Web version, 4x6, 8x10, etc. You can price accordingly. You choice as to sell higher than a print. I don't disagree that a digital 4x6 should be priced higher than a 4x6 print. That's why I suggested a package price in your middle sales range. Someone who wants digital only isn't interested in a pricey print package. Will they pay more for all the digital files? History tells me they won't, but you know your client base better than I do.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Think happy thoughts.  Think happy thoughts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Baltimore, Maryland Wedding and Portrait Photographer

Offline Jeff Behm

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12093
    • View Profile
    • http://www.behmphoto.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2017, 09:53:27 AM »
The bulk of my work since digital is commercial, just like Nanette.  So, much of my thinking is now divorced from the fine arts mind-set you mention.  But when I shot film for retail work and in my early days of digital, I thought the same as you, Todd.  No way did they get negatives, digital or otherwise. 

My suggestion to tie a print purchase to its digital file would never start with an 8x10, certainly not as an inclusion.  Included files would be reserved for prints 20x24 and up (maybe 16x20, YMMV) or albums, and the included file would be a JPEG, 1200 pixels, max, long side, maybe less.  Basically, FB post size.  I'd also sign the digital file.  Not watermark it with my big commercial watermark logo, but sign it, like I used to with prints, using a blend of white India Ink with just enough black added to make it light gray.  I'd then use a nib pen and sign it for real.  These days, that impulse might lead to my purchase of something like https://photologo.co to give me a stylish signature again, only applicable to both prints and digital deliveries for retail sales. (by the way, the jrbehm retail logo below is in Zapfino)

As for delivering digital files, I do.  90% of my work is commercial, and 90% of commercial clients are happy with hi rez JPEGs, 3000 to 5400 pixels long side; for those who desire TIFFs, no problem.  Many clients buy hi rez and lo rez JPEGs of each selection for ease of email. 
« Last Edit: May 05, 2017, 10:13:00 AM by Jeff Behm »

Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2017, 10:03:47 AM »

My suggestion to tie a print purchase to its digital file would never start with an 8x10, certainly not as an inclusion.  Included files would be reserved for prints 20x24 and up (maybe 16x20, YMMV) or albums, and the included file would be a JPEG, 1200 pixels, max, long side, maybe less.  Basically, FB post size.  I'd also sign the digital file.  Not watermark it with my big commercial watermark logo, but sign it, like I used to with prints, using a blend of white India Ink with just enough black added to make it light gray.  I'd then use a nib pen and sign it for real. 


What I do now is provide 4"x6" @225 dpi files with the books and albums.  Big enough to print 4x6's, wallets, use for digital photo frames, etc.  I've seen people printing 5x7s from these and they're better than I'd like.


Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2017, 10:05:09 AM »
I'm thinking of making it a perk.  As in, "spend $1200 and I'll upgrade your digital files to full resolution."


Offline Jeff Behm

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12093
    • View Profile
    • http://www.behmphoto.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2017, 03:31:00 PM »
I would be cautious not to tie the file size perk to the purchase amount blatantly.  Instead, with wording like "Our premier package, XXXX includes a high resolution digital file of that image, fully retouched and suitable for additional gift sized prints for family and friends." or words to that effect.  Within that Package XXXX would be lets say, a 20x24, plus an 11x14 (for Significant Other) and 1 or 2 8x10 for Mom or whoever.  The cost of the digital file and lost sales of smaller prints could be factored in, too.  Compensate by making them canvas prints for finest presentation with a great sales pitch, and put all that into a price with "Savings to you of...." when purchased a la carte.  Have 1) a low package, a 16x20 or less with no file, 2) a middle package with at least a 16x20 one file and 3) a big package with 2 or 3 images, prints from each plus the files (eg. 20x24 and two companion 11x14 from the additional shots). 

when not the including full rez files, I'd suggest 1200 pixels long side.  Probably the best print from that is going to be a 4x6.  If that's too much, make it 1000 or 900 pixels, with higher resolution files priced in steps according to expected use. 

 

Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2017, 08:37:21 PM »
Screw it.

If I don't want to give away the full res files, I don't have to.

The end.

Offline Jeff Behm

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12093
    • View Profile
    • http://www.behmphoto.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2017, 08:15:37 AM »
Where is the old  +1 when we need it?

Offline Darren Cassese

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7081
    • View Profile
    • http://www.fotoglyphics.com
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2017, 01:48:25 PM »
Nobody "needs" a full res version of this product. I think you are more than fine to sell scaled digital files.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Think happy thoughts.  Think happy thoughts.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Baltimore, Maryland Wedding and Portrait Photographer

Offline Nanette Reid

  • Authenticated Members
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 647
    • View Profile
    • nanette reid | architectural & interior photographer
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #13 on: May 12, 2017, 01:08:35 AM »
Where is the old  +1 when we need it?

Can I +1 that too? ;)

Offline Todd Muskopf

  • Authenticated Members
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6714
    • View Profile
    • http://www.muskopf.org
Re: Digital Only...
« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2017, 07:36:16 AM »
Group hug... ;)